Camera Talk.....

[Discrover]

Come on, the Leica SLR R series isn't what comes to mind when thinking of Leicas. The rangefinder M series are the Leicas I was referring to. Do you feel that the M series are WAY overpriced as well? You could buy a M6, use the shit out of it and sell it for close to what you bought it for.

Like I said earlier, the new Nikons and Canons Digital SLRs are nice cameras that get the job done. I'll probably end up with one myself one of these days. They still don't have the charm of a Leica.

No Mike I will not argue the point of Leica and charm....they defiantly have the largest charm factor of any camera made no doubt. If I purchased my equipment based on sentimental value *charm* I would buy one myself. They are again quote *cool*, but in my field not practical.

I will sum it up like this....again Leica is equivalent to the Ferrari or Porsche of camera's. If I had to have a vehicle to get to the scene of a accident for a newspaper I would still pick a Land Rover any day over a Porsche or Ferrari. Why you ask? Because if you are trying to maneuver through bar ditches and down and up the side of overpasses to get there...even though you can drive close to 200mph in the sports car...you are still going to be stuck in traffic with everyone else.....by the time you reach the scene the wreckers will have already picked everything up and will be sweeping the highway clean of dabree.

It brings to mind the Texas Land Rovers Club slogan.

Quote: You can go fast, but I can go anywhere.

I just can't argue with that logic....

OH, and I have used my Land Rover MANY times to be the first photographer on scene of many major accidents . I have had other photographers who choose to drive Econo-Line type vans ....tell me; Damn man you are already here.....I am going to have to get me one of those things....how the hell did you get through all the traffic.

I simply reply I made my own road.


Land Rover RULES.....keep your Porsche....and I just sold my Porsche 3 months ago, because it set in the garage the last 7yrs and only went about 25 miles in that time. I actually got tired of looking at it taking up space in my garage. I'm afraid I would do the same with a Leica in my camera bag.

 

[Ho]

Ho,

Thanks for the peer pressure...LOL!

yeah man, you gotta give in. i went to my kids school for some halloween stuff. i was there snapping some pics with my dinky NON-SLR camera. i look around, and every mom there had a 20D!!! i felt so out of place. LOL

 

[F18Guy]

MILF with an DSLR....nice.

Okay back to our regular programming.

 

[agro1]

OH, and I have used my Land Rover MANY times to be the first photographer on scene of many major accidents .

I always wonder who the jerks are taking pictures of people critically injured on the side of the road.
Now I know.

 

[campbell]

OH, and I have used my Land Rover MANY times to be the first photographer on scene of many major accidents . I have had other photographers who choose to drive Econo-Line type vans ....tell me; Damn man you are already here.....I am going to have to get me one of those things....how the hell did you get through all the traffic.

I always wonder who the jerks are taking pictures of people critically injured on the side of the road.
Now I know.

No kidding agro!

That IS pretty shitty Todd and not something I would never be proud of.

 

[koby]

yeah man, you gotta give in. i went to my kids school for some halloween stuff. i was there snapping some pics with my dinky NON-SLR camera. i look around, and every mom there had a 20D!!! i felt so out of place. LOL

So Ho, when are you going to get your 20D?

 

[Mike_Rupp]

Craig, what lens(es) are you using on the 20D? It seems that most people go out and buy a camera with a high price tag and then buy it in a package with a crapola lens. When I bought my film camera years back I did the opposite. I got the Nikon N70 (nothing special about it at all) but bought a 35-70 F2.8 lens that cost about twice as much as the body.

Most camera debates focus way too heavily on the body and not enough on the lens. A crappy body with a great lens will do much better than a pro body with a crapola lens.

 

[koby]

I bought the 20D with a crappy 18-55mm lens.

I knew the 20D was a good body and for an extra $75 or so I got a cheapie lens that I figured could play with the cheapie stocker lens until I learn my shit. With the exception of the 18-55mm that came with the camera all of the lenses I have are hand-me-down EF lenses that I'm just playing with until I decide what lenses are worth investing in.

Oh shit, I almost forgot to answer your question.

I have a 70-300mm EF lens and a 28 mm lens as well.

 

[koby]

Most camera debates focus way too heavily on the body and not enough on the lens. A crappy body with a great lens will do much better than a pro body with a crapola lens.

I do agree that not enough time is dedicated to lenses in amateur circles.

However, I'm not so sure about the crappy body with a great lens part of your statement. There are somethings that great lenses can't overcome. For example, I wanted a camera with fast burst capability. I was looking at the 10D versus the 20D and a big reason I chose the 20D because of the speed.

I believe that both body and lens merit discussion as a system because one without the other makes for an incomplete camera. I'm just ignorant to the lenses that are available and need to learn before I invest so I went with the body I liked.

 

[Mike_Rupp]

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/bnh/con...04&is=GREY&addedTroughType=categoryNavigation

Craig, that should be a really good lens for the 20D. Not cheap, but it should be a good all-around lens. I prefer fixed focal length lenses as they are usually metal body lenses that are durable. I have a Nikkor ED 70-300mm F4-5.6. It has decent quality glass, but feels kind of cheap and it virtually impossible to hand hold at 300mm unless using 800 iso film.

 

[Discrover]

I always wonder who the jerks are taking pictures of people critically injured on the side of the road.
Now I know.

I am a professional photographer and have been on call as a freelance photographer for the Ft. Worth Star Telegram and the Dallas Morning News. If they call me I go that simple.

News is News no matter....It is not my favorite gig...mostly again I enjoy the challenge of getting to the scene more than the actual picture taking. I have a press pass and am not just some idiot ambulance chaser there gawking for the fun of it and snapping pictures with my point and shoot.

If you watch the frigging news than you know it has to be filmed and brought to you by reporters and photojournalist doing their J-O-B. My 10yr old niece is in critical condition right now at Children's Hospital in Dallas and may not pull through, so I know first hand of what it is to have a love one in a severe car accident.

If you go to my photography website....http://www.toddhollyphotography.com and click enter main page and then scroll down you will see some pictures taken by me on scene at the Light House Day Care Center this summer which was a National News Story ...breaking on Fox-CNN- and all other national news networks.

I again was the first still photographer on scene for the Ft. Worth Star Telegram. You may not like what I do, but I am sure you read the story in your local news paper and look at the pictures. So, I will make NO appologies and yes I am VERY proud of what I do.

When my picture makes the paper no matter what it is...it is a great feeling to know you are the man behind the lens.

 

[koby]

Not cheap, but it should be a good all-around lens.

Gotta pay to play. I wouldn't expect anything less for this camera.

I prefer fixed focal length lenses as they are usually metal body lenses that are durable. I have a Nikkor ED 70-300mm F4-5.6. It has decent quality glass, but feels kind of cheap and it virtually impossible to hand hold at 300mm unless using 800 iso film.

This is the kind of shit I need to learn.

 

[Discrover]

Here is a list of my lenses;

*Nikon 50mm AF - Fixed Focal f1.8 - awesome glass low light lens
*Nikon 70-300mm AF f4 D-Series - Plastic P.O.S - trash lens - terrible optics - way to soft - Junk waiste of money - worst lens Nikon ever produced.
*Nikon 70-200mm AF f2.8 IFS VBR zoom - Awesome Lens - http://www.sportsshooter.com/gear_profile.html?id=58
*Nikon - AF 400mm f2.8D ED-IF-S Fixed Focal Lens - http://www.sportsshooter.com/gear_profile.html?id=19

Sigma - AF 24mm-70mm f2.8 zoom -
http://www.ritzcamera.com/webapp/wc...1&catalogId=10001&langId=-1&productId=7398989

Sigma - AF 70mm-210mm F2.8 Zoom-

I am hoping maybe Santa will bring me one of these, but I am not getting my hopes up;
http://www.adorama.com/NK6004AF2U.html

I still need to some day add a really wide agle to my bag like the Sigma or Nikon 14mm, but at $1,500 dollars for the Nikon version...I just don't know I would ever use that lens enough to justify price.

What Mike said about fixed focal is right on....there is NO Zoom lens that has the clear optics of a fixed focal it is just that simple.

 

[Mike_Rupp]

When I bought my N70 several years back, I thought fast burst speed was important for me. Honestly, I've never used the mode on the camera. What's more important to me is how quickly the camera is ready to shoot. Digital cameras are finally getting better in this regard. My crappy P&S Nikon drives me crazy with how long it takes to take a shot after the camera is turned on.

In regards to lenses, a general rule is that the faster the lens (f2.8 vs f4.5 for example) the better.

 

[montanablur]

Canon Mark II DS
EF Lens system

Mac G5 in the office
Powerbook G4 on the road

Adobe CS

I don't shoot stills much anymore, but this is a great camera to have on the set. I started out with Canon and it is what I know. I feel like I'm driving on the wrong side of the road whenever I pick up a Nikon, but I can't take anything away from Nikon they create really quality products.

While I agree the Leica is nice it does not compare with the Canon or the Nikon digital, and the fact that it only has an lcd viewer made me sell mine pretty quick. For non-digital leica's are amazing and my M7 is rarely very far.

http://www.hasselblad.se/

That is as good as it gets. Hands down.

 

[koby]

When I bought my N70 several years back, I thought fast burst speed was important for me. Honestly, I've never used the mode on the camera. What's more important to me is how quickly the camera is ready to shoot. Digital cameras are finally getting better in this regard. My crappy P&S Nikon drives me crazy with how long it takes to take a shot after the camera is turned on.

In regards to lenses, a general rule is that the faster the lens (f2.8 vs f4.5 for example) the better.

I attend a lot of sporting events and love taking photos of athletes I know, so the burst mode is nice. This is especially true since now I don't work in Sports Medicine any longer and can actually enjoy the sporting events I go to. LOL

Oh, the super fast ready time of the 20D was one of the many things that caught my eye.

 

[AndyThoma]

I read that it's best to pair a DSLR body to a lens that was made for digital cameras. Some thing about the focal point has to be specific to give a correct f/stop value if related to a film SLR.

But I really don't know if that's true. I am just starting to admit a DLSR would be nice to have. I'm in Paul's boat too, I want to start playing with digital. I have a canon rebel TI film camera and I'm starting to feel like a dinosaur with film. Last november in moab everyone stood around looking at pictures from that day on Curtis laptop, and all I could say is " I'll show you my pictures in 3 months when I finally remember to develop them..."

 

[F18Guy]

Luke...Todd.....I would like to keep this constructive.


In my research today, I found lots of different packages for the Canon 20D; for example:

Canon 20D via Bizrate and Costco

An example package for the Nikon D70:

Bizrate

It seems as though the Nikon is a bit less expensive compared to the 20D. So my question to you pros is: is that extra 2 MP and burst capability worth the additional expense?

I am going tomorrow after work to go "touch and feel" some cameras.

 

[Discrover]

I always wonder who the jerks are taking pictures of people critically injured on the side of the road.
Now I know.

One other note....I have totally enjoyed the debate in this thread...hopefully I had added some positive input with my honest opinions. If you want to stir the s#$% Argo....and work on getting people wound up by calling names and being a jerk...why don't you trek back over to the KVT thread....

It seems to me that Kyle maybe your huckleberry.

 

[RBBailey]

Luke...Todd.....I would like to keep this constructive.


In my research today, I found lots of different packages for the Canon 20D; for example:

Canon 20D via Bizrate and Costco

An example package for the Nikon D70:

Bizrate

It seems as though the Nikon is a bit less expensive compared to the 20D. So my question to you pros is: is that extra 2 MP and burst capability worth the additional expense?

I am going tomorrow after work to go "touch and feel" some cameras.

Well, of course every little bit of MP in the camera counts. But not as much as you might think. Going to a larger MP on a sensor size that is the same as the lower MP will create more noise. i.e. -- theoretically, the D70 has less noise than the D200 simply becasue they are packing more MP into the same size sensor. However, they also have new generation processing and ISO computing that brings the noise level down. The D70 has very little noise for what it is. But the D200 actually, in spite of the theory, has less -- for various reasons.

By the way, Noise = static in the photo.

The other consideration with MP size is simply the size of the print. Take a ruler and measure out 12 x 18 on the table, you will see that this is a significant size print for someone who is simply trying to make good photos with a nice camera -- for your personal use. With the right PS techniques I can get a 20 x 30 print out of my 6.1 MP D70 that is sharp and smooth enough that no one in their right mind would say I was stupid for not buying 8MP's.

The bottom line is that 6 to 8 MP isn't that big of a difference. But 6 or 8 to 12 is making a big jump.