Dexcool.

sven

Well-known member
There's a sticker on my D1 rad that says "Do not drain". Yeah right...

I use the green stuff and distilled water every 2 years. G-05 is 22 bucks a gallon and only one shop in town has it here. I use G05 in my Volvo because it doesnt leak ;) Peak Global Lifetime is another good antifreeze.
 
Oct 27, 2004
3,000
4
rover4x4 said:
Ive heard it makes vehicles run cooler. My research seems to indicate its low on silicates which seems to be a good thing.


Cooler? Maybe, but not because of heat transfer properties, but cavatation....




The Japanese are the ones pretty adament about NOT using silicates in their coolants. This dates back to about 1980 when silicates were first used and caused early water pump seal failures. It did not cause gross leaks, it just caused them to seep or "weep". But that is enough to contaminate the pump bearing and eventually cause it to fail also. Phosphates reduce cavitation erosion and I assume this is a major reason the japanese retained phosphates in their OAT coolants. Might be BMWs thinking, I dont know.

In high levels, silicates tend to gel and settle into cooler areas of the cooling system. Ford had a rash of TSBs/recalls to address this exact issue. The gel inhibits heat transfer and coolant flow. The silicates also form abrasive compounds that do damage. The low volume cooling systems that are now common are more sensitive to these problems than older cars. Silicates provide the fastest acting aluminum protection. But this fast acting protection is not needed in most cars unless abrasives have already formed. Except in extreme cases (IE: aluminum oxide contamination) low silicate levels are more than adequate. There are many zero silicate coolants (Toyota, Honda, etc) that have proven themselves to provide excellent protection.

Water pump cavitation becomes a bigger problem under severe service conditions like heavy loads, high rpm, rapid engine accelerations. More likely in the "Ultimate Driving Machine." then a Rover. In some engines this is exagerated by a combination of cold ambient temp and heavy load because of the reduced radiator flow. Cavitation damage is worse in aluminum components. Water pumps are most common but intake manifolds, etc, have been destroyed by cavitation.

Using Gallon jugs of distilled water (To insure freshness) is the way to go. The potential problem comes with longer service intervals and silicate free phosphate free coolants. These coolants are already lower pH and do not have silicates or other sacrificial additives that are included in conventional coolants. This makes it more likely for them to have problems near the end of their life cycles. Leeching minerals directly from engine components is a pretty remote and extreme example. It does occur in industrial cooling systems but is not likely to ever happen in any 50/50 coolant/water mix. I did see a couple of examples that appeared to be leeching problems, but in one case cavitaion due to a combination of performance modifications is a more likely explanation and the other appears to have be a bulk water storage problem (carbonic acid).
 
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Chris:
Everything you have stated tells me that using the correct coolant, clean water (either deionized or distilled) and changing it often is the way to ensure adequate cooling system performance and longest life.

As it seems that contamination is the big thing to avoid, flushing and refilling often and keeping the cap closed are about the best things one can do for their cooling systems.
 
Oct 27, 2004
3,000
4
I would agree with that. Dexcool goes south then its not topped off fully.

Most caps however, are not in spec anymore. They get weak,tired and dont hold the proper pressure.

Again, I would agree with what you say, unless we get to diesel.
 

MUSKYMAN

Well-known member
Apr 19, 2004
8,277
0
OverBarrington IL
ptschram said:
Land over used to say every 24 months.

I've seen intake manifolds deteriorate to the point of replacement with good old green ethylene glycol coolant.

I find it curious that Land Rover indicates 24 month coolant flush intervals, but dos not provide a drain plug!

this is because the correct way to do this according to the EPA is to pump it out the top and reprocess and recycle the coolent.
 
Chris-St Louis said:
Again, I would agree with what you say, unless we get to diesel.

I don't want to even think diesel! I have one in the shop right now and we discussed importation last week.

The American regulatory system is badly broken, along with our energy policy. Yup, we gots to get lots of mileage, but "don't even think of trying to bring in a Diesel if you're a registered importer, or we'll slap your pee-pee"! Fawking customs/EPA!
 
MUSKYMAN said:
this is because the correct way to do this according to the EPA is to pump it out the top and reprocess and recycle the coolent.

Oh? I spent 19 years doing environmental stuff and don't remember reading anything about this. Got a cite??? 40 CFR?

I was working for AEP when Ethylene Glycol was listed as a hazardous air pollutant with a reportable quantity of one pound, and read the reg when it was promulgated, but don't remember anything along the lines of a BMP for draining and filling vehicle radiators/cooling systems.
 

MUSKYMAN

Well-known member
Apr 19, 2004
8,277
0
OverBarrington IL
havent you seen the pump out equipment for coolent?

having worked for the EPA I would think you would have?

http://www.asedeals.com/antifreeze_recycler.html

thats a example...I have a good friend that owns a number of oil change places and its all they have used for ages. She told me that they cant even dump it in a open air environment it has to be pumped from vessel to vessel in a closed system.

the lady knows her shit to so I hav e to say you need to catch up paul this is old news.
 
MUSKYMAN said:
the lady knows her shit to so I hav e to say you need to catch up paul this is old news.

30 seconds of research proves this to be BS. Cough up a regulatory citation or tell the woman who owns the shops she's full of **it.

It could well be a local or state regulation, but I couldn't find any references to it being a regulatory requirement.
 

MUSKYMAN

Well-known member
Apr 19, 2004
8,277
0
OverBarrington IL
paul the lady isnt full of bull shit I have known her for 20 years and she is as sharp as anyone I know.

30 seconds of research on any subject shows you dont do very good research.

she is located in IL...do you know all the IL regualtions?

do you think she would spend 3 grand on a pump if she didnt need to?

oh yeah my radiator guy has one as well he must be a idiot as well.
 
MUSKYMAN said:
paul the lady isnt full of bull shit I have known her for 20 years and she is as sharp as anyone I know.

30 seconds of research on any subject shows you dont do very good research.

she is located in IL...do you know all the IL regualtions?

do you think she would spend 3 grand on a pump if she didnt need to?

oh yeah my radiator guy has one as well he must be a idiot as well.

LOL, until YOU can provide me with a regulatory citation, it is all bullshit.

Come up with it or be quiet.

I can't find it in any federal regulations.

I don't profess to know any of them, just how to find them when I need to-if there were one in this case, I'm sure I'd have found it by now.

As always, if proven wrong, I'll back down.
 

Blue

Well-known member
Mar 26, 2004
10,057
870
AZ
EPA regs? Who gives a shit....just leave it out in saucers for the neighborhood cats.
 

MUSKYMAN

Well-known member
Apr 19, 2004
8,277
0
OverBarrington IL
ptschram said:
LOL, until YOU can provide me with a regulatory citation, it is all bullshit.

Come up with it or be quiet.

I can't find it in any federal regulations.

I don't profess to know any of them, just how to find them when I need to-if there were one in this case, I'm sure I'd have found it by now.

As always, if proven wrong, I'll back down.

come up with it or be quiet?

are you for real?

:rolleyes:
 
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DiscoJen

Well-known member
Aug 27, 2004
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The Lou!
I think you two need to settle your fight the old fashioned way...strip down and wrestle in a tub of somewhat coolant colored lime jello!