Random Stalling...

ReVoR.ca

Well-known member
Jun 20, 2008
118
0
Cornwall.ON.CA
97 D1, 285,000 km. plugs, wires, battery, cats, air and fuel filters all changed within last 3000 km.

The truck stalled on me (in the middle of an intersection while turning through oncoming traffic no less) last night on my way home from work. It did it again on the way to work this morning, and no less than 7 or 8 times while I had it idling in the parking lot during my 1 hour lunch break.

It will do it both while idling and under load driving down the road...it will suddenly sputter and quickly die with no warning. Truck runs fine otherwise. Sometimes it starts nicely, other times it takes several tries and much mashing of the skinny peddle to get it to fire...with mixed results. It also seems to start fine after it has been sitting for a while, only has a hard time starting after it has stalled.

I had it idling for a good 15 minutes at one point until it died. Once I got it restarted it then died 3 times in under 5 minutes only to run fine again for 10 minutes after that.

I understand a bad/dirty stepper motor can cause it to die at idle, but would this also happen while driving down the road with my foot on the gas? I've done some searching and there seem to be several other culprits, CkPS, fuel pump, TPS to name a few, but I'm not sure which one could cause it to die both at idle and under load...unless more than one thing has gone wrong at the same time. Is there anything I'm missing or should be looking to check first?

A few possibly related symptoms I have had include...

Last winter in the -40 cold it would occasionally not hold idle once the choke was off (had to put in neutral and hold my foot on the gas to keep it running at intersections etc...). It always started no matter how cold it was, just keeping it going with the choke off was the issue.

Also the last few months I have noticed that when I start the truck first thing in the morning (or when it has been sitting for quite a while) the engine surges to around 1500 RPM and holds itself there for 10 seconds or so until it creeps back down to a normal idle (or at the very least where the choke wants to keep it at 1K).

I do have an alternator going bad...sounds like the rear bearing has been chewing itself up for quite a while but I haven't seemed to get any charging issues because of it, money has been too tight to swap it with all the other stuff going wrong.
 

Quentin

Well-known member
Mar 19, 2006
419
0
Cape Town, South Africa
Mmmmmm. Looks like you need PT's input on this one, but areas to check would be:
Stepper motor - pull and clean and ensure a new washer or gasket sealer is used.
Throttle Potentiometer - might be old and worn = slipping
Fuel Pressure - check pressure on the fuel rail (right hand side above the heads)
MAF ??
Check on those while you wait for one of the "Real Pro's" to comment :)
 

landdog

Well-known member
Jan 14, 2007
67
0
Chattanooga, TN
Same thing happened to me in my D2. Different animal, I know, but absolutely identical story. It was a bad relay. I wish I could be more specific, but it was a hunch and we were brainstorming. I had the mechanic replace the two or three most likely offenders and it never happened again.

Hope that helps - I know it's vague. It was not the CPS - he replaced that first and it didn't help at all.
 

ReVoR.ca

Well-known member
Jun 20, 2008
118
0
Cornwall.ON.CA
I will start pulling sensors and checking them on Tuesday when I'm off work, hopefully I can track down a fuel pressure gauge by then as well and figure out how to use the damn thing. I would love to try and get it to my local shop and get the codes read to see if that sheds any light on things but I don't trust it in traffic even the slightest bit.

Beyond that my abilities at troubleshooting a problem like this are limited at best and every garage within an hours drive are hopeless when it comes to Rovers...leaving me with the dealership in Ottawa which is completely out of the question.
 

ReVoR.ca

Well-known member
Jun 20, 2008
118
0
Cornwall.ON.CA
*UPDATE*

So I couldn't find a fuel pressure tester for under $80 ($80 at Canadian Tire...$499.99 on sale at Napa :smilelol:)...I still have a few friends to ask and see if I can borrow one before I drop that kind of money.

I did however do some testing with a friend today and I may not need a tester to tell me I have little or no fuel pressure.

I got the truck running (first time I tried in 2 days) and it idled for 2 or 3 minutes before sputtering to death. I was unable and am still unable to get it started. We decided to try the valve on the fuel rail to see if there was any pressure there at all. Pressing down the stem on the valve only let a single drop of fuel come out on a rag...not a spray of gas like we expected. Anytime I try to start the truck now, it almost catches at first (can hear it fire a couple times, barely) and then it just keeps cranking.

I haven't been able to hear the pump running with the key turned on even with my ear right up against the tank.

I'm assuming it's the pump, but I know it could be a relay, the regulator, or the wiring. What's the best way to check all of these other items?
 

landdog

Well-known member
Jan 14, 2007
67
0
Chattanooga, TN
Your local shops shouldn't be THAT clueless about Rovers - it's just a car after all. They may not have the diagnostic computer whiz bang software, but they can test a fuel pump. They can test injectors. They can troubleshoot and diagnose a modern engine. It's not the space shuttle.
 

Two Cold Soakers

Well-known member
Apr 24, 2007
1,450
0
49
At your mom's
Make a fuel pressure gauge.

Start with female / male brass fitting - a screw on female schrader / barbed. This will be the hardest part to find so look at an industrial supply house or Farm&Fleet.
Get abooot 18" of gasoline-proof hose
Get a pressure gauge that goes from 0-50 psi.
Get a fitting to go from the hose to the gauge - barbed / threaded.
Get 2 clamps.
Those fittings might cost 8 bucks. The gauge can cost from 10 -30 bucks. 10 bucks will get a plastic lens that will get pulled after the first use - gasoline will permanently fog it. 30 bucks will get you a glass lens & fluid filled mechanism - overkill.

Failing that, use a tire gauge, but the gasoline will eat the seals and it might not work so good any more.

If I could post photos I would.
 

ReVoR.ca

Well-known member
Jun 20, 2008
118
0
Cornwall.ON.CA
*UPDATE*

I hooked up my volt meter to the harness at the pump. The white/purple wire is giving me 12V DC with the key in the on position...

So am I correct in saying all my relays and whatnot work, and that this sounds like the pump itself is dead? When the harness is connected to the pump I do no hear it priming or running at all. I also still have no pressure when I open the Schrader valve on the fuel rail.

Is there anything else I should double check before I pony up the $300 to get a pump shipped up here from the states?
 

ReVoR.ca

Well-known member
Jun 20, 2008
118
0
Cornwall.ON.CA
I've been looking at the aftermarket pump swap and I'm going to find out how much that chevy pump is tomorrow at the local parts store just for the hell of it.

The problem is, I don't think my sending unit is going to survive being removed as the fittings/lines are so corroded...bad enough that they are starting to split the plastic on the top of the unit. A hacksaw (or cutting the rubber lines) may be the only way to get the thing off, which completely negates the point of changing just the pump. I think I would feel safer ordering the whole unit rather than being stuck with a new pump and nothing to put it in.

I'd post a pic but the forums are telling me I've already uploaded my maximum number of images...